Rent increase hostage to windows?

Rent increase hostage to windows?

15:13 PM, 26th November 2021, About 2 years ago 18

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Hi, My tenants have not had a rent increase for the last 3 years and I need to do this now. Unfortunately, they are refusing the rent increase and tenancy renewal unless I fix the windows.

The windows have some mist collecting between the two panes of double glazing. The windows are fine otherwise.

I cannot afford to get this done. Am I obliged to do this? What are my options?

The tenants are now being difficult.

Any advice, please?


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Paul Shears

7:46 AM, 27th November 2021, About 2 years ago

Reply to the comment left by Terence Joseph at 26/11/2021 - 17:42
I could not agree more but triple glazing is so cheap, if you shop around, that I see no reason to not buy it.


7:50 AM, 27th November 2021, About 2 years ago

Hi. There is a couple of issues here. Yes the misting is a problem with double glazing units. Check the warranty - it should be ten years yes just ten year.
The double glazing units are still performing as the airspace is "still air" just not as good.

When you do replace the glazing make sure you seal the trims well Normally its water lying on the bottom rail that is getting through the seal.

Grumpy Doug

9:47 AM, 27th November 2021, About 2 years ago

Simon, just replace the glass as others have said. Cheap as chips if you can do it yourself. You can buy the necessary tools for it for less than a tenner on eBay and watch a video on YouTube for how to do it. If the individual panes aren't too large, the cost can be from £20 - £50 per panel.
I did my first one a few years ago with some trepidation, but don't think about it now.

Malcolm Ratcliffe

11:04 AM, 27th November 2021, About 2 years ago

Reply to the comment left by Katy Ann at 26/11/2021 - 17:54
The energy saving provided by double glazing is mainly due to the air gap between the glass panes. If the seal breaks down moisture can condense hence the misting. There is still an air gap and the thermal efficiency will be slightly reduced, but in practice you wouldn’t notice.

Jessie Jones

12:10 PM, 27th November 2021, About 2 years ago

It sounds like your tenants are offering to agree to the increase in rent, just that they want something in return which isn't at all unreasonable when negotiating a change in contract.
The negotiation is a commercial one. Consider the costs of replacing the glass with what you will get from the increased rent. Consider the likelihood of your tenants giving you notice to leave, and the likely costs of any advertising and void periods. Consider whether you would need to replace a single unit or many units, and whether you might have to do this anyway if the tenants leave.
Notably, some councils seem to be considering that misty windows are an HHSRS hazard! Nottingham City Council Selective Licensing Team would certainly consider issuing you with a fixed penalty for not sorting it.
That said, I have declined to replace a couple of small units which are top openers in a bay window with 8 units in it. The misting is minor and doesn't interfere with the line of sight. The request was made before the tenancy was agreed. If the tenants asked again, I would probably accede as they are valued tenants and it makes commercial sense to keep them.
As others have said, if you cannot afford the repair, then being a landlord might not be for you. But don't splash out money for a minor bit of misting.


12:02 PM, 1st December 2021, About 2 years ago

Reply to the comment left by Jessie Jones at 27/11/2021 - 12:10
"...some councils seem to be considering that misty windows are an HHSRS hazard"

Fascinating (and not in a good way).

Personally, I would change a blown double glazing unit every time, but I am very interested to understand on what basis a misted pane would constitute an HHSRS failure.

How, for example, does it differ from a window that has an frosted pane installed in it?

Granted, a tenant might be inclined to look elsewhere rather than accept a tenancy where the living room window was part frosted glass, but in what sense could this reasonably be described as hazardous?

Unusual in a living room perhaps but surely not unique as a feature - bathrooms (of course) but also entrance doors and associated glazing as well as certain windows that are a little too "public" - all are often fitted with frosted glass.


13:52 PM, 1st December 2021, About 2 years ago interesting point about 'misting' and HHSRS. So what is the answer? If panes are misted it usually indicates a breakdown in seal - so there is no HHSRS concern here.
No doubt the council will get you on the environmental aspect (if they are called in by tenant?) saying as a direct result of the misting the d/g unit isn't working to the best of its ability, but again does that means it really needs to be replaced? There are clearly two panes of glass safely in situ - its only the void in between that has been 'compromised'.

Jessie Jones

14:07 PM, 1st December 2021, About 2 years ago

Reply to the comment left by Badger at 01/12/2021 - 12:02
I can't give any answers to how the council think that HHSRS is compromised, as it isn't illegal to have a single glazed window so long as the EPC meets E or better. But Nottingham City Council Selective Licensing Team have their own anti-landlord agenda and make up the rules to suit themselves.
This link shows an otherwise perfectly sound window, with misting between the panes, and how the council are forcing the landlord to repair it. If you scan through the rest of their tweets, you will see how their inspections rarely identify HHSRS failures, but are mostly enforcements of what might be considered as decorative standards !
You have to go a long way back to find any evidence of a 'rogue landlord'.

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