No Gas and No gas certificate?

No Gas and No gas certificate?

0:01 AM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago 28

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Hello, what do you do as a responsible landlord when your plumber arranges an appointment not once but twice to visit your tenant’s flat on the anniversary of your gas safety check to be greeted by the tenant/contract holder (Wales) with there is no gas running to the boiler.

The tenant hasn’t paid the bills and was then told to make another appointment and there would be gas supply this failed to happen, on the second occasion, and I suspect this will be the case from now on.

If in the future this tenant would need to be evicted, one of the statutory requirements is a valid Gas Certificate in Wales.

Wonder if HSE and the legislators have thought this scenario through! Interested to hear other people’s thoughts.

Thanks,

Kim


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Comments

Reluctant Landlord

11:45 AM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

I had same situtaion (England).

Ended up telling the tenant that she will be evicted unless she topped up her meter to allow gas flow for the annual cert to be carried out. Took two months. Told the council too so I had everything on record.

Helped when I explained that the Council would also not look favourably on her as deem it 'voluntary homelessness' . Didn't hurt either reminding her that the rent she was paying would only get her shared accommodation IF the council were to offer her anythign (she is in a one bed self contained flat)
Eventually she paid the gas bill, told me, I rushed the gas guy round and cert issued.

Sometimes you got to state the bloody obvious and plant a seed in their mind. Let it fester and they will always take the easier way out when youo remind them of the consequences if they dont. I also copy in info fromthe local council website to confirm what I am saying is correct.

Nikki Palmer

12:04 PM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

Reply to the comment left by Reluctant Landlord at 10/10/2023 - 11:28
Everyone is very quickly assuming that the supply has been cut off - I would suggest otherwise but the OP has not made it that clear.

If it is a pre-payment meter it should be able to be topped up.

Because the tenants arranged for the second visit it would suggest their credit had run out on both occasions?

Darren Peters

12:12 PM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

Reply to the comment left by Nikki Palmer at 10/10/2023 - 12:04
If this is the case the answer is simple. I assume that pre-payment meter can't go very far into debt since that is how they work where I am. Instruct and pre-pay the engineer to top up the meter just enough to do his tests.

Michael Booth

12:26 PM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

Reply to the comment left by Nikki Palmer at 10/10/2023 - 12:04
Assuming she tenant has money to top card up , my 25 years experience tell me they havnt and the card is removing debt from what is owed this includes the emergency part of the card.

Nikki Palmer

12:35 PM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

Reply to the comment left by Michael Booth at 10/10/2023 - 12:26
The emergency credit can be topped up - my suggestion was that the Landlord request that the heating engineer did that. I appreciate it goes onto the Landlord's invoice but it's a small price to pay to get a property back

Reluctant Landlord

12:38 PM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

Reply to the comment left by Michael Booth at 10/10/2023 - 12:26
despite what it is assumed, if a tenant does not top up the debt keeps accruing and you wil never be in credit again until at least 95% is topped up. If the debt is £100 and the tenant tops up £95 quid it shows a £5 deficit but they can push the button and get £5 0r £10 'emergency' whcih means there is gas until that amount runs out. Then they are back to debt accruing

Thats what my tenant did at the end of the day. And no doubt will be the same again this winter. No more government vouchers so this situation is going to happend to a lot more landlords if any gas checks are due over the winter period....

Nikki Palmer

12:43 PM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

Reply to the comment left by Reluctant Landlord at 10/10/2023 - 12:38
I know how it works - thank you

Jack Craven

12:43 PM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

The dept keeps adding up because there is a standing charge to pay daily regardless if they don't use any gas, same with electricity.

Gunga Din

14:49 PM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

IIRC one of my gas guys said they could issue some sort of certificate, or certain wording on the CP12, to the effect that there was no gas flowing through the meter, the meter had been capped, therefore no safety issue.
I woukd then take the second safety check visit out of the tenant's deposit (after warning him first of course).

C-cider

16:49 PM, 10th October 2023, About 7 months ago

From the HSE website

(Quote) A landlord has to show that they took all reasonable steps to comply with the law. HSE recommends the following best practice in these circumstances and strongly advises that a record be kept of all correspondence with the tenants:

* leave the tenant a notice stating that an attempt was made to complete the gas safety check and provide your contact details;
* write to the tenant explaining that a safety check is a legal requirement and that it is for the tenants own safety. * Give the tenant the opportunity to arrange their own appointment;
HSE inspectors will look for at least three attempts to complete the gas safety check, including the above suggestions; however the approach will need to be appropriate to each circumstance. It would ultimately be for a court to decide if the action taken was reasonable depending upon the individual circumstances.

It is a good idea to include arrangements for access in the tenancy agreement. (Unquote)

I wouldn’t ask the gas safe engineer to cap the supply. That would need to be their choice otherwise it could be seen as harassment.

Once three attempts have been made, I’d issue Section 8 (and Section 21).

Why do 20% of tenants cause 80% of the work?

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