Section 21 issue with a tenant in situ?

Section 21 issue with a tenant in situ?

0:04 AM, 10th January 2024, About 4 months ago 20

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Hello, My tenant has been in the property for a very long time, even before I purchased it in 2006. I have tried to sell the property with them in situ but no takers which I tried for around 6 months. I gave them four months notice to vacate but the council pays most of their rent and as typical with the council they have been told to sit tight and wait for the bailiffs.

I then made an application to the court for possession. The tenant opposed it only on the ground that she didn’t see why they should pay the court fee as they are on benefits. This was last August. I chased the court in October and was told it was waiting to go before a judge.

I chased again last week and the court e-mailed to say the file was off site and they would review. The next day I had an order to strike out my claim which had clearly been struck out by the judge back in August but the court had not told me about it. The reason for the strike out was that I had said the tenant was in occupation pre 2006 and had not provided the tenancy agreement from 2006.

I had explained in my claim that we purchased the property with them in situ, I also had no idea that the court expect you to provide every Gas Safety certificate and every AST for the entire duration of the tenancy – this was not the case when I had a possession order 5 years ago!

I have e-mailed the court twice to appeal the decision and to again offer an explanation regarding the occupation and the fact that I don’t have the AST from 2006 when I purchased the property.

My biggest concern is I don’t have a tenancy agreement from 2006, so why is a document that is 18 years old even relevant when the latest AST was provided?

I provided Gas Safety certs going back about 5 years but I don’t have them going back to 2006. I just don’t understand why these are relevant.

Is there anything that can be done to remedy a situation where you don’t have all the AST’s, all the gas certificates?

Everything else is in order, I have the electrical certificates, the details of the deposit scheme, the tenant’s How to Rent guide etc.

Are the courts saying, if you don’t keep all of the paperwork the tenant can stay forever? I have a mortgage that expires in a few years so I need vacant possession so I can do it up and sell it, I won’t be able to take out another mortgage. If they don’t go then the lender will simply repossess the property and they will no doubt be evicted at that point, it doesn’t end well for any of us!

Please, does anyone have any ideas as to what I should do next before I engage a solicitor?

Thank you,

Nicola


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Comments

Mr Asif

8:47 AM, 11th January 2024, About 4 months ago

Really stressed, government must take strict action to protect landlords and make easy the eviction process

Fed Up Landlord

9:41 AM, 11th January 2024, About 4 months ago

The judiciary, like many of our institutions and politics has been infiltrated by left wing thinking. " Tenants Good - Landlords Bad" is the mantra.

Julesgflawyer

8:06 AM, 13th January 2024, About 4 months ago

Maybe it isn't an AST. How do you know without the tenancy agreement and details of history, that it is? Could be an assured tenancy or even a regulated tenancy under Rent Act 1977. As claimant in a possession action the onus is on you to prove, on balance of probabilities, that you are entitled to that. I suggest you get some proper legal advice

Julesgflawyer

8:08 AM, 13th January 2024, About 4 months ago

Reply to the comment left by Fed Up Landlord at 11/01/2024 - 09:41The job of the judiciary' is to apply the law fairly and impartially, not to plug gaps in the DIY claims of landlords who don't understand the law or the procedure.

DP

8:22 AM, 13th January 2024, About 4 months ago

Question, has anyone any advice if you put a semi-commercial property up for sale with tenants in situ either via normal marketing procedures or at auction what happens if the buyer wants to evict the tenants in order to carryout extensive re-furbishments meaning they couldn't remain living in the building. ie if section 21 has been abolished. Would the tenants have any grounds to resist in view of current proposals regarding the tenant reform bill. All have AST agreements and up to date paperwork.

Julesgflawyer

8:36 AM, 13th January 2024, About 4 months ago

Reply to the comment left by DP at 13/01/2024 - 08:22
It's the buyers problem, not yours. I imagine s21 is likely to be phased out, not abolished at a stroke for all existing ASTs.

John Parkinson

9:39 AM, 13th January 2024, About 4 months ago

Reply to the comment left by Julesgflawyer at 13/01/2024 - 08:08
Could’ve been a verbal agreement between Tennent and the previous landlord

How should the court rule in this case?

If the judges are following a code or guidance, guidance is wrong. However, based on the story above, there is something fundamentally wrong with the court process.

John Parkinson

9:41 AM, 13th January 2024, About 4 months ago

Reply to the comment left by DP at 13/01/2024 - 08:22
There are other grounds I suggest you look at the act it’s not that long

Andrew

13:23 PM, 13th January 2024, About 4 months ago

A solicitor would want to play straight and cost you money and time, you need to deal with the tenant. You should try and get a copy of the agreement/s from the housing benefit office, you might get lucky and speak to a helpful worker. You can sort out the gas certificates by speaking to a friendly gas engineer, or finding someone who's good on a computer, you can't do the same with tenancy agreements because the tenant would know. You bought the property in good faith thinking you would be able to evict the tenant. One always needs to make sure the paperwork is right before buying a let property, it clearly affects the value sadly. You say the tenant needs a bailiff order to get housing, you can both work on getting that sorted, it's a no brainer, you have to collude with the tenant and sort the backdated paperwork, then make a new application and explain to tenant that if any paperwork is received from the court to ignore it until the possession order is issued, and later the bailiff order. You'll become friends.

moneymanager

13:44 PM, 14th January 2024, About 4 months ago

Reply to the comment left by TheBiggerPicture at 10/01/2024 - 11:22
Any older tenancy terms would have been overridden by subsequent tenancy agreements.

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