One student wants to leave a joint tenancy and rent not received?

Reply to the comment left by "Yvonne Francis" at "23/09/2016 - 13:29":

That is a level of interest far beyond what a court would order. At 68% cumulative or 52.14% flat, a bank charging that would be vilified and possibly sanctioned by the FCA.

Reply to the comment left by "Bill O'Dell" at "23/09/2016 - 14:52":

68% aer

Reply to the comment left by "Bill O'Dell" at "23/09/2016 - 14:52":

Hello Bill, just to be clear you have referred to me twice, but the person who originally posted is called Nick, it's not me I was just the first to post a reply. Thanks.

Reply to the comment left by "Y L Newbury " at "23/09/2016 - 16:52":

My Apologies! Misread the start of the thread.
Bill

Just to make things clear the 1% weekly I can charge on late payment of rent is on the very few occasions I need to use this, this is just a threat and would only be used if claiming rent became expense which has never happened in all my 35 years of renting. I have never actually taken interest even when offered it. I had it looked at by a solicitor and he accepted it, While my tenants parents question some things on my lease they have never questioned this, but thanks Chris for the advice: I will look into it as the advice my solicitor gave me was some time ago.

Bill, you did not say in your first comments that you only do things with your tenants permission, which may have made a difference or was that an afterthought as your comment sounded a tiny bit belligerent. I rent in Oxford and here locking rooms and putting in strangers would constitute harassment. And if you did lock a door which door exactly would you lock? As the tenants in a shared tenancy have the run of the house and can use each others rooms.

Expecting the rent does not imply that I don't know that students some need help and guidance and I give plenty of that but at the same time you do need to respect their housing rights which you seem to think differ from professionals.

I don't know what area Nick lets in but in Oxford rooms are always in demand but if I left things drift without warnings or rent statements then students being students would not bother to find replacements. From what Nick writes he looks as if he is doing the right thing but may need a bit more time.

It's perfectly acceptable to charge interest on late rent.

The risk of trying to charge at a very high rate is that it may be considered a penalty and thus unenforceable.

On the other hand, locking a room as suggested would be illegal eviction, which is a criminal offence.

Thank you all for your thoughtful responses.

The suggestion to look for PhD students is a good one - I’ll follow that up - and I am grateful for comments on guarantors next time around etc. Of course I will do all I can to resolve the situation through consensual means by helping the group find a new housemate and then offering a replacement tenancy etc. and I am still hopeful that we might be able to do that. What I am trying to prepare for though is the scenario where attempts to find a housemate fail, the girls’ relationship deteriorates further, co-operation ceases and I am left having to pursue one or all of them for the outstanding rent.

I understand that I can hold the remaining 3 liable for the whole rent (and the tenants tell me they understand it too), I also understand that I can pursue the 4th girl for her rent even though she is not physically in residence but what I am trying to figure out is how and when I might do it. At what point would I issue proceedings, for example, if it came to that? Let's say the remaining 3 give me 4 months rent each in the 2nd month (Oct) of the contacted 12 (Sept 16 – Aug 17), which is what they plan to do, but the 4th girl gives me nothing then they won't technically be in arrears until month 4 will they (i.e. I will have 3/4 of the 4 months rent)? Then if they pay again in Jan they will be back in credit until the end of Feb so it is not until they make their April payment that the arrears start to really catch up with them. Should I be holding off taking formal action until the end of the tenancy on that basis? Do I need to bring an action against them all as a group or against each of the 4 individually or can I choose to only take action against the 4th girl only? It is this mechanism that I am looking for advice on. I guess someone else has tackled this before and may know the best way to go.

By way of background I have 4 student houses which I have been letting for 15 years with no more than the usual problems. I’m not a rookie and have taken a view on guarantors etc. which I am comfortable with but have never really understood how to deal with this problem where one of the group default and it cannot be solved by agreement. It is a new situation for me but one I have been aware might happen

Nick

I hope you don't mind me commenting again but this problem has arisen from making alternative arrangements for receiving rents. If you where receiving rents monthly then this problem would not have been created. A part of me says would it not be possible to go back to monthly rents and even stronger part of me says an agreement is an agreement and should be kept to, depending of course on how it was given and how desperate you are to solve this problem in this way.

As I said before I think the best way is to replace the tenant and find better advertising sources. In my first comment I did put a site but it failed to come out live because of a small mistake. I will try again, http://www.accommodationforstudents.com they are a national site for students and Landlords. I checked Oxford where I am based and there were currently lots of students looking for places. Your tenants could also use Spare Rooms which I have found useful for individuals and does the University your students attend have an accommodation officer? There are online news papers. Oxford has one called Daily Info who advertise free and send out printed sheets to be displayed in colleges. Even Agents would find a tenant for a price of course.

If the rent is not paid by the tenant who has left I know that MyDeposits where I register my deposit accepts claiming unpaid rent. However speaking personally I would prefer to solve this by other means.

I must say that although I have had this problem and sorted it amicably without loss of rent and with suitable tenants it has not been without it's worry. So I do wish you a swift success.

Yvonne

I am advertising via Accomm for Students and SpareRoom and also in other places. I am hopeful that we will find a replacement but from what you say of Oxford we are in a different kind of market here. A few weeks ago we filled a room in another house and although we were successful the glut of freshers that usually come forward in August just was not there and we filled it with the only applicant we had - good house, good room, reasonable rent too.

I am trying anticipate how to deal with this in the event that we don't find a replacement which is why I am asking the question. I appreciate that the termly rent adds a complication but the problem would still be present if the money was coming in monthly.

Suppose this was you and you were receiving 3/4 of your rent and couldn't get the other room let how would you move forward in terms of enforcing the contract? The scenario is that there are 4 people on a single contract with joint and several liability, one has left but is in touch and the other 3 are paying the portions agreed between them but you are 1/4 short each month.

Nick

I'm afraid I have no experience beyond collecting forms from the Small Claims Court and as the payment was made, they were never used. Also as I have guarantors and keep to the terms of the payment on my lease. So I would be faced in a slightly different situation. However, I'm not sure how useful they would be but I could give you some of my opinions.

I would send a rent statement by email, to all the tenants as I usually do a few days before it is due billing them for the full amount owing. I give my tenants two weeks from the due date to pay. A few days before the two weeks are up I contact those who may not have paid to ask them for their 'contribution' and point out if they delay beyond the two weeks allowed I can charge interest or let me know if they have any problems paying this bill or when can I reasonably expect payment. At this stage I usually get all the payments. However if it went beyond this stage I would send an overdue statement to every tenant. I name (hopefully not shame!), the tenants who have not paid their 'contribution' but at the same time make very clear they are jointly responsible. In other words get those tenants who have paid to encourage those who have not, in their own self interest if nothing else. It's a great lease for Landlords: I wonder at times at how we get away with it!. In my case I would remind the guarantors of those who have not paid. Only at a later stage would I involve all the guarantors.

If it went beyond this, then I would, besides investigating procedure at the Small Claims Court, as I would be new to this, seek legal advice. From all I know in my situation I would take all the tenants or all the guarantors. I know you need two months or eight weeks of arrears before you can claim. I also know that you need to send regular statements. In my case these are usually enough to get tenants to pay.

I think you have complicated things with you new rent agreement. Had you charged monthly and the tenancy has started on 17th September then you would already know if you were to be paid in full or part, and probably the one who left may have paid for that month. And if you had a shortfall of rent you could have sent overdue statements which would have sent a message to your tenants of the seriousness of the situation and your intent. I may be wrong but by the end of the second month you could have taken action.

I don't know how you made this new agreement but if you can make this agreement stick then you could bill them for one third of the full rent for payment 1st October. If they only pay three quarters and you send them another statement pointing out the unpaid quarter is overdue, then the statement would show arrears. The process of arrears would then become immediate and the usual process of claiming rent after all the required arrears had accumulated may apply.

However I think if the tenancy started on 17th September and if the tenant who has now left took up the tenancy then that means you have only known about this and have been advertising for less than a week? I have found that it's no good basing letting on past experiences and all advertising is a matter of luck and events always take a different course. I let to the same College, by recommendation for over twenty years. My plumber said my tenants thought my houses part of their annex. It was called a 'legend' by them. It suddenly stopped for no reason I could see and I had to look for tenants from other colleges. Your experience at your other house may not be repeated. I don't think you have allowed enough time. I once took three months even in Oxford, although luckily the guarantor of the outgoing tenant paid.

You did say that you had advertised at accommodation for students but if that is the case then its best for your tenants to put in adverts as there is a special section for students only, which from what I've seen have mostly individuals advertising or wanting rooms.

I do confess that without parental guarantees and if these students have no money then the situation is very difficult and if it was me I may compromise. You do have the right to take the deposit from all of them so there is loss of rent limitation. If you are really keen to not lose rent and you didn't mind the work then you could let to the three on separate leases, rooms with shared facilities and reclaim the room. Airbnb perhaps?